Router speed control

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Router speed control

Postby marteng » Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:29 pm

Hello guys,
I'm currently setting up my router on my larger cnc and am having issues with getting it to run properly and consistently both manually and software controlled . I am using Mach3, SuperPID router speed controller and connected to a CNCdrive HDBB2 breakout board (output#4 - 0 to 5 V analog).

The following is what's happening:

1) When switching over to manual control with potentiometer on the minimum it runs fine at 5000rpm but mach3 measures the rpm of between 1000 and 2000. When increasing the speed to 25000 rpm it locks on to full speed and killing the power supply is the only way to reset it at a lower speed.
2) When switching over to Mach3 control, (which should be switched off) it automatically starts spinning to full speed even when not cutting.

I have checked the connections 3 times and went through the manuals and settings for countless times but to no avail. I also recorded, applied the same configuration from my other cnc with a similar setup but using Rutex drivers instead...... still no success.

Are there any settings that I may be missing? I am also seriously thinking that I would need a ModBus driver. A quick search on the latter indicates that these are normally used to control AC spindles.


Anyone has had this problem before or maybe knows how to go about it? Any help is much appreciated.
Thanks Marteng
marteng
 
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Re: Router speed control

Postby marteng » Thu Mar 05, 2020 8:28 pm

Further to my last post, I have done some checking, relocated all connections from HDBB2 output4 to Analog Port on UC300ETH-5LPT and managed to get the SuperPID speed reading to corresponds with that showing on Mach3. But still cannot get to vary the speed through Mach3 either by over riding or by making a cut at any speed. On the other hand when driven manually it responds very well.

When I try to run it automatically through Mach3, the router speed runs consistently at 5000rpm when it should be off. When I press "Spindle Off" button in the spindle calibration window the speed goes up to 10000 rpm. Pressing "Spindle Off" again will reset speed to 5000rpm again and increasing the speed in Mach3 has no effect at all. Also a message "PWM is bumped to minimum setting" is displayed at the bottom. I have gone though all settings and through the manuals but still cannot find what I am doing wrong ....... I am sure there is a setting that I am missing or interfering with another.

The following are the connections from SuperPID to UC300ETH-5LPT:
1) +5V to +5V. (Supply).
2) GND to 0V. (Supply).
3) RUN is connected to output pin 14 of port 5.
4) TACH is connected to input pin 8 of port 5.
5) PWM is connected to analoge output 1 (pin 6).

Later on I also will be installing a 130W CO2 laser which from my understanding should controlled similarly in the same way as the router and allocate it to output 2 of the same analog port, but for now I hope to have this problem solved first before moving onto the next.

I am also considering of switch from Mach3 to UCCNC software as I feel this will solve (or at least easy) the complications. On the other hand however have concerns if UCCNC can jog the cnc by means of a joypad which I have found both effective and efficient.

I do hope and appreciate if someone has any ideas?
Thanks Marteng
marteng
 
Posts: 26
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Location: Malta

Re: Router speed control

Postby ger21 » Fri Mar 06, 2020 12:15 am

First thing I would do is measure the voltage at the Super PID Run terminal when clicking the spindle on/off button in Mach3. You should be seeing 0V and 5V when you turn the spindle on and off.

Then measure the analog voltage going into the SuperPID at different RPM's, and see if you are getting the proer voltage.

You really need to post all of your Mach3 settings that you are using.
Did you set up the pulleys? DO you have the ports and pins right for the spindle?

The Tach input does not need to be used, so I would remove it until everything is working. All it does is allow Mach3 to display the RPM from the SuperPID, and I don't recall exactly how it even works. But it has zero affect on SuperPID operation.
Gerry
UCCNC 2017 Screenset - http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html
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Re: Router speed control

Postby marteng » Sat Mar 07, 2020 5:31 pm

Hello Gerry,
Sorry for the delay in responding but needed to run some further checks, apart from those you proposed!
I have re verified all connections & settings and as far as my understanding goes it should be good but I highly doubt that this is the case as I am still stuck where I was and am sure there is something that I am missing.

So I measured the voltage on the PWM and found 1.13V @ 5000rpm and 1.27V @ 17000rpm (I don't thing this is a correct proportion when the max speed is 25000 rpm), the voltage on the "run" (spindle on / off) is also varying inconsistently in between 0 to 5V, by inconsistently I mean that this also varies by spindle rpm speed.

Pulley 4 is set Min Speed 5000, Max speed 25000 and ratio 1.

Spindle pin outs:
PWM : Analog Port output1 of UC300ETH-5LPT board - This is set in the PlugIn Control - UC300ETH In/Out monitor (as can be seen on the attached screen shot).
Spindle Run (on / off) : Port 5 pin 16
Optional Index: Port 5 pin 8 - prefer to have it connected as this serves me as a confirmation that speed is consistent. Also since the Super PID is 2.5 mt (that's the CNC length) away from the PC I can have an easy visual.
5V power supply to Super PID: from the same UC300ETH-5LPT board supply, so as to have a common ground.
Further more I had Spindle Run on / off (Port 5 pin 16) also set as well in the Output Signals settings as Output 14 but was not working either, so I disabled it in case this was conflicting, yet still no progress.

Also I am not sure if the following would make any sense, but originally board was mounted with a USB port instead and had the upper part replaced with the ETH type, back that time Balazs told me that there shouldn't be any issues. I tried to contact him as well but I think he is busy at the moment!
Thanks
Marteng
Attachments
UC300_Router2.zip
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UC300_Router2_settings.jpg
marteng
 
Posts: 26
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Location: Malta

Re: Router speed control

Postby ger21 » Sat Mar 07, 2020 6:01 pm

So, if you assigned port 5 pin 16 to Output 14 in Ports and Pins>Output Signals, you'd then assign Output 14 to M3, and uncheck "Disable Relays". This should get you 0V when the spindle is off, and 5V when it's on.
The voltage should not be varying with RPM. If it's varying, you may have a serious noise issue?

Unfortunately, I've never uses the Analog Outputs and plugin with Mach3, so I wouldn't know where to start with that.

I use a Super PID with the parallel port, and it's a very simple setup.
Gerry
UCCNC 2017 Screenset - http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html
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Re: Router speed control

Postby marteng » Sat Mar 07, 2020 8:56 pm

Ok, I know what you mean, I will try it out. I do hope there aren't any noises, as I was very careful about this issue! Fingers crossed.
Thanks
marteng
 
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Location: Malta

Re: Router speed control

Postby marteng » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:51 am

Hi Gerry, I have set the M3 to output 14 as you proposed, but still no success. To further verify if this was a noise problem I got the speed controller wire separately away from possible noise generation and still didn't work. Further more I thought it might be a firmware problem so I updated it as well and yet it didn't work. I am seriously starting to think this might be a bug and tried to call the supplier but is not answering............ I do hope to eventually get it running!
Thanks Marten
marteng
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:57 pm
Location: Malta

Re: Router speed control

Postby marteng » Sat Mar 14, 2020 5:33 pm

Hi Gerry, Some updates....well I've further done some more checking and trials but it seems like Mach3 isn't fully compatible with the drives I am using, therefore I will purchase the UCCNC software and do the switch. After reading about it, seems like it should fit my requirements to be able to jog the cnc by means of a joypad and have PID router and laser control.
marteng
 
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2016 1:57 pm
Location: Malta

Re: Router speed control

Postby ger21 » Sat Mar 14, 2020 6:24 pm

If it won't work in Mach3, it probably won't work in UCCNC.
There's nothing that would make Mach3 "not compatible" with anything you are using.

Most likely, you have a wiring or configuration issue. Perhaps UCCNC might be easier to configure?
Gerry
UCCNC 2017 Screenset - http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html
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Re: Router speed control

Postby marteng » Sun Mar 15, 2020 5:28 pm

Hi Gerry, well I was hoping switching to UCCNC would solve the problem. I have to admit though I am very confused how could connecting 2 control wires be so problematic after so many attempts & trials without 1 success. I humbly ask, what would be a typical terminal connection and settings to either HDBB2 (output4) or UC300ETH (Analog port) controller?
I have also thought of installing a printer port on my pc to dedicate for router and laser control. Is that possible to run the cnc with both UC300ETH and the printer port to work together at the same time? I'm not sure just asking for a possible solution.
Thanks
Marteng
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Posts: 26
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